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Should other Orgs be able to use the same freestyle title?

 
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RichardP
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 4:05 pm    Post subject: Should other Orgs be able to use the same freestyle title? Reply with quote

I've split this into a separate thread. Originally, it was in response to the following :

Southern Jiver wrote:
Please note that I have added the Leroc.com Axminster Late Lounge freestyle to the Calendar and the list above.

Another 'Late Lounge' eh?! The cheek of it!

Just remember who made it first - thank you Richard and Jo of Ceroc Fever!!!
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Olly
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richard P said
Quote:
Another 'Late Lounge' eh?! The cheek of it!


I too must admit at being surprised at finding another Late Lounge crop up - coincidence, possibly? Surprised But we checked everywhere to make sure that no one else had used the Late Lounge name before we launched in February. We also consulted with many of our dance friends nationally to check that they had not heard of anyone else using the 'Late Lounge' name for a MJ event. There is not much we can do, but I am sure that dancers who attend these respective events will know the difference! Cool

However, saying that, I would hope that other organisations are not trying to trade off the reputation that the Ceroc Fever Late Lounge has gained to date. Evil or Very Mad
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DR
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Olly wrote:
There is not much we can do, ..:


I don't know about that Olly. This is what Wikepedia says about 'Passing off'..

Passing off is a common law tort which can be used to enforce unregistered trademark rights. The tort of passing off protects the goodwill of a trader from a misrepresentation that causes damage to goodwill.

The law of passing off prevents one person from misrepresenting his or her goods or services as being the goods and services of the claimant, and also prevents one person from holding out his or her goods or services as having some association or connection with the plaintiff when this is not true.


IMO another Modern Jive organization running a dance night that has exactly the same name as a competitor's is trading off the reputation of the other company. It confuses dancers and is underhand in the extreme..
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drunkenjiver
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2011 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This thread seems to be turning into a kangaroo court,takes me back about 10 years ago when Ceroc were trying to say they owned the rights to the Modern Jive moves, tut tut the cheek of it. Surprised
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Andy McGregor
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DR wrote:
Passing off is a common law tort which can be used to enforce unregistered trademark rights. The tort of passing off protects the goodwill of a trader from a misrepresentation that causes damage to goodwill.
I remember my training in this subject from a course I was put on years ago. The course was 3 days on Copyrights, patents, design rights, etc so I don't claim to be an expert - but the firm running the course were experts working for our company who'd just won a case in the House of Lords regarding Jif Lemon. I was taught that passing off is much to do with the damage that might be done to reputation. Also, that it's more to do with the appearance or 'get-up' than it is to do with the name.

As 'late' and 'lounge' are both words in common English usage they are not protectable by trademark. You could brand the name with a nice design, but not the words themselves. To do that you'd need a jazzy spelling like 'Layte Lynge'.

To win a case of 'passing off' you would have to prove that a real consumer was actually confused between the two offerings, not just that there was a possibility of confusion. And you would have to prove and quantify actual damage to reputation. In other words, you need to prove that someone thought 'Late Lounge' A was the same as 'Late Lounge' B and that the situation had damaged the reputation of A.

If the branding, design and get-up of the product was very different it would be difficult to make a claim of passing off. Then you would have to consider the regional aspect of the matter. And the length of that the phrase 'Late Lounge' had been used. You could not have one 'Late Lounge' in Southampton and then make a claim that someone else running a 'Late Lounge' in Bristol or Leeds was harming your businesss.

My guess is that the name has not been around long enough for there to be a strong reputation that could be damaged or anything going on that would confuse the public - any more than DR's usual level of confusion!

However, one thing that makes the MJ market unique, IMHO, is that consumers regularly debate the business of MJ. This means the chattering classes of MJ might decide they don't like the actions of company B in copying 'Late Lounge' - meaning that company B loses customers - unless their Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy is better that the bugle player in Company A.
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DJ Bry
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could be wrong, but didn't 'Beach Boogie' on the Isle of Wight 1n late 1990's and early 2000's use the term 'Late Lounge'. (now known as Rock Bottoms) Then run by Andy Flemming, Tor, Rena Swanapole, John Brett, Heather Mac (Hev), Nigel Anderson and Nina Daines.

I used to go to these, and Russell Payne of Leroc.com also DJ'd at these events well into the early hours of the mornings.

They had several settee's to lounge in and stickies, buns, coffee etc were served with bluesey music playing.

There must be loads of other Forum peeps who could add too or correct this!

Also Danceswinguk.com claim to be the original 'Late Lounge'!!

Is it now just a, 'Generic Term' for dancing into, 'Extra Time' at a Freestyle??
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Last edited by DJ Bry on Wed May 18, 2011 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Andy McGregor
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DJ Bry wrote:
I could be wrong, but didn't 'Beach Boogie' on the Isle of Wight 1n late 1990's and early 2000's use the term 'Late Lounge'. (now known as Rock Bottoms) Then run by Andy Flemming, Tor, John Brett, Heather Mac (Hev), Nigel Anderson and Nina Daines.

I used to go to these, and Russell Payne of Leroc.com also DJ'd at these events well into the early hours of the mornings.

They had several settee's to lounge in and stickies, buns, coffee etc were served with bluesey music playing.

There must be loads of other Forum peeps who could add too or correct this!

Also Danceswinguk.com claim to be the original 'Late Lounge'!!

Is it now just a, 'Generic Term' for dancing into, 'Extra Time' at a Freestyle??
This just goes to show the truth in the saying 'those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it'.
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Southern Jiver
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just as a clarification, I have it on good authority that the Red Hot Rhythm Freestyles at Axminster have been using the title "Late Lounge" since July 2009.
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drunkenjiver
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The voices of reason have prevailed Cool
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Olly
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for clearing that up SJ - Just a coincidence. Smile
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TVguy
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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

..So Ceroc stole the name then? Olly didn`t do his research very well. Tut Tut Smile
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Andy McGregor
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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TVguy wrote:
..So Ceroc stole the name then? Olly didn`t do his research very well. Tut Tut Smile
It's to do with youth. And Olly is very young. He probably wan't born when the tide came in on Beach Boogie!

However, Olly has done nothing wrong. As I said further up, the name itself is unprotectable.
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